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gapper468
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Aug 13, 2009, 2:48 AM
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smoking distributor
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Can anyone help on this one? I have a 1964 chevy van g10, six cyl. with points, rotor, and condensor, for apparently no reason the other day it wouldnt start and the distributor started smoking inside. The small wire from the coil to the distributor was very hot. I have bought all new parts to put in, to replace, but before I burn up more stuff I wanted to check and see if anyone might have some tips for what I can check ( the points appear to be ok ). This is an oldie it still has the voltage regulator and generator if that helps. Thanks, appreciate any trouble shooting advice or warnings.
G468
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Hammer Time
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Aug 13, 2009, 3:18 AM
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Re: smoking distributor
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That's a bit odd because that particular wire is nothing but a grounding circuit and should have no power in it unless the coil is shorting the power feed to ground. Make sure the hot wire on the coil isn't touching the metal housing anywhere that would connect those wires together.
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gapper468
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Aug 13, 2009, 6:04 AM
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Re: smoking distributor
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Thanks so much I will do that. The funny thing is, is that I was getting ready to change out the points with the electric box that you can install in the dist. cap. that would have been costly.
Thanks again,
g468
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Sidom
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Aug 13, 2009, 8:27 AM
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Re: smoking distributor
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This is just a little out of the range of the stuff I work on.... Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't those older chevys use resistance wire for the dist + to drop it down to the 9 volt range. Straight 12v could cause some problems........
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DanD
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Aug 13, 2009, 8:40 AM
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Re: smoking distributor
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They sure did; it was an in harness section of resistor wire, it drop the voltage down to 5-7 volts; when the ignition was in the run position. The ignition coil received full system voltage during cranking; via the by-pass circuit, that was feed by the starter solenoid’s “R” terminal.
As for the smoke coming out of the distributor it was/is likely a shorted to ground condenser.
On a side note; if you’re still going to put in the “electronic box” check whether it wants system voltage (12V) or the reduced voltage that the point system is using.
Dan.
Canadian "EH"
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Hammer Time
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Aug 13, 2009, 9:32 AM
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Re: smoking distributor
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You guys are referring to the power feed to the coil. This problem is the trigger wire between the distributor and the coil (negative side)
Unless he's got the wires hooked up wrong to the coil.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Aug 13, 2009, 9:33 AM)
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Loren Champlain Sr
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Aug 13, 2009, 10:42 AM
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Re: smoking distributor
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gapper; I agree with Hammer's last reply. Check the coil. You should have 12V ignition voltage to the (+) terminal. The lead-in-wire goes from the (-) terminal to the points. A very common problem on these, as with all points/condensor, make certain that the lead-in wire and the wire from the condensor are not touching the breaker plate. The lead-in wire should be readily available from NAPA. GM used the same ones, for years. Open the points and take a look. I'm sure you'll find them a bluish color, from excessive heat. Replace the points, condensor, and the lead-in wire. If you need specs, let us know. .017" to .019" gap on the points should get you running, but best to use a dwell meter. Of course, you'll need to set timing afterwards.
Loren
SW Washington
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DanD
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Aug 14, 2009, 12:24 AM
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Re: smoking distributor
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I’m not sure why you guys (if you are?) think Sidom and I were talking about the neg coil wire between the coil and breaker points?
All I was doing is agreeing with him that the voltage going into the coil is or should be at a reduced rate with the ignition switch in the run position. The only time there should be full battery voltage available at the coil, is during cranking. This reduced voltage is to lower the amount of arcing across the points, as they open
I’m not disagreeing that something has taken the negative side of the coil to ground allowing current flow through the coil, all the times (points open or closed), causing the no start and the smoke (over heating the circuit).
Yes I also agree that it could be the wires that are touching the breaker plate causing the short. But if there isn’t a wire touching and all insulation is ok; it also could be the condenser that is shorted to ground. You cannot see this and it would take an ohmmeter to confirm it.
That’s all I was trying to say; obvious I didn’t make myself understood. Sorry.
Here’s a diagram showing the by-pass circuit and the resistance wire to reduce source voltage.
Here’s a couple of things I don’t understand and I’m thinking are wrong.
That's a bit odd because that particular wire is nothing but a grounding circuit and should have no power in it
Yes it will have power (voltage) on it; like when the points are open.
On a properly functioning point ignition system; when the points are open, you will have source voltage on both the positive and the negative coil terminals. There’s no current flow; so there’s no voltage drop across the ignition coil’s primary wirings. A voltmeter will show the same voltage on both terminals.
Once the points close; current will begin to flow from coil positive through the coil windings to the negative terminal of the coil, through the closed points and then to ground. Voltage now on the negative terminal will be very low due to the voltage drop across the coil’s windings. What that voltage is, all depends on the ignition coils resistance value.
If this were the case.
Make sure the hot wire on the coil isn't touching the metal
Wouldn’t the wiring harness before the coil be “smoking”; likely burning out the resistor wire in the harness?
Gapper said
The small wire from the coil to the distributor was very hot.
That tells me the short to ground is after the coil and why things didn’t go from just smoke to burning is because of the voltage drop of the coil and or the condenser’s insulation might be failing, allowing a constant but small amount of current flow; not a direct solid connection to ground.
So gapper; change the points & condenser; check the primary wiring and all should be good.
Again if you are going to change this ignition system over to electronic; you may need to get rid of the resistor wire.
Dan.
Canadian "EH"
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Hammer Time
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Aug 14, 2009, 12:55 AM
Post #9 of 12
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Re: smoking distributor
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I've seen many a point type car left with the key on and points closed and never overheated or melted the wire to the coil. I would think the coil would have to be shorted to carry that kind of current across that wire.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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gapper468
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Aug 18, 2009, 9:07 AM
Post #10 of 12
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Re: smoking distributor
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Holy crap, you guys know ay too much but thank you all for this it s been an interesting read. But I must admit I am a little confused about the resistor. there is one there but nothing is hooked into it currently. My van no has all new wiring (did it this last weekend) a new coil , points condensor and rotor, I tried to start it but it wasnt getting a spark, I checked the coil and it was fried? anyway I have the new one but if there is a chance of cooking it w/o the resitor I better check that option out. I appreciate the wiring diagram those are not easy to find for that set up. It looks to be different than the way it was rigged before. It is a bit unusual that I do have one wire coming out of the voltage reg #3 that goes nowhere. I will look into. Thanks again and if you have some more advice please shoot it my way, I am still learning on a budget.
Thanks again
M
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gapper468
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Aug 18, 2009, 9:14 AM
Post #11 of 12
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Re: smoking distributor
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ok, I think I understand, but if I dont switch over to the electric "box" in the dist cap yet do I ustill use the resistor? if so where exactly soe that go int the link. before or after the coil? And does it just make a loop through the resistor to reduce the voltage? Thanks a million.
M
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
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Aug 18, 2009, 9:17 AM
Post #12 of 12
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Re: smoking distributor
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All cars with points start on 12volts and run on 8volts. That's what the resister is for. When the key is in "start" position, you will have 12v at the +side of the coil. When the key is in the "on" or "run" position, it should only be getting 8 to 9 volts at the coil. that prevents the points from burning out. That's why you should have 2 wires on the + side of the coil and just the distributor on the - side of the coil unless you have a tach hooked up and that will go on the - side also.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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