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1992 honda civic wont start
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medicalpurposes
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Dec 27, 2012, 4:11 PM
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1992 honda civic wont start
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My son says it just died on him. I have checked for and found spark from distributor cap. When fuel line is loosened from outlet side of fuel filter and key is turned on, there is fuel. What would let me have fire and fuel and still not start. engine turns over very well?
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Tom Greenleaf
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Dec 27, 2012, 4:26 PM
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Re: 1992 honda civic wont start
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1. Not enough fuel pressure
2. No injector pulse
3. Valve timing jumped or way off to broken?
* Compression check if fuel pressure shows up to par might be the next move to isolate this,
T
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medicalpurposes
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Dec 27, 2012, 4:43 PM
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Will check 1 and 2 tomorrow. is valve timing and engine timing one in the same?
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Hammer Time
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Dec 27, 2012, 5:17 PM
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It's either valve timing or ignition timing. There is no engine timing.
I'd be jumping right to the compression test first
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Dec 27, 2012, 5:18 PM)
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Discretesignals
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Dec 27, 2012, 6:16 PM
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Which engine are you dealing with 1.5L or 1.6L? VTEC or not VTEC? If 1.5L and not VTEC, 8 or 16 valve?
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Dec 27, 2012, 6:18 PM)
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medicalpurposes
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Dec 27, 2012, 9:47 PM
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1.6L, I am thinking its a vtec, but it sits a hour away from here so I cant take a look right now. Ignition timing was what I was reffering to...do not know anything about valve timing. I wouldnt think a compression issue would come instantly w/o warning, but then again, I dont know. I will tell you more tomorrow.
(This post was edited by medicalpurposes on Dec 27, 2012, 9:51 PM)
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nickwarner
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Dec 27, 2012, 10:00 PM
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If the timing belt has jumped time it will immediately change the compression because the valve timing will be off. Others will correct me if I'm wrong but I think the 1.6 is the freewheeling motor and the 1.5 is interference. If this is a jumped timing belt issue you should pray its a 1.6 so you're only out a timing belt kit. If you jump time on an interference engine you will bend all your valves in the first two revolutions. It gets very expensive.
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Discretesignals
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Dec 27, 2012, 10:09 PM
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Unfortunately, both 1.6 and 1.5 are interference.
Since we volunteer our time and knowledge, we ask for you to please follow up when a problem is resolved.
(This post was edited by Discretesignals on Dec 27, 2012, 10:11 PM)
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Tom Greenleaf
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Dec 27, 2012, 10:16 PM
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Valve timing would be any reason a belt or chain can't keep time with the crankshaft - if so compressions would be uniformly low or nothing. Lost my chart but this should be an interference engine so damage would happen if off by much. If (probably) a rubber timing belt and plain broken bent valves, no compression. That can happen without much or any warning.
Ignition timing would all be in the mix but not conclusive alone, but if off, why? Pretty much that stays where it was left last and not high on the list to be a surprise.
Presence of fuel at fuel filter doesn't mean it got delivered even if pressure is adequate. Just rule things in or out for a beginning,
T
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Hammer Time
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Dec 28, 2012, 4:13 AM
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Stop trying to dance around it and take the compression test. A jumped belt will effect many other things like dominoes so you need to know the basics before looking any further.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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medicalpurposes
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Dec 28, 2012, 9:28 PM
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Well, I finally made it back...thanks for your patience gentlemen. I did not succeed on my mission, as I took only a few tools to pull spark plugs and do a compression test with. I did not realize that I would need to remove valve cover, etc to do this...the the spark plug wires, with the extensions going thru the valve cover was not something I have ever seen. I did jot down a vin number and engine block id number and learned this. It is a 1995, not 92. The engine block number D15B7 is not a VTEC. I apologize for this taking awhile, and I must work two 12 hour days, so the next time to look at it will have to be Monday and I will do that compression test. Wished the car was close, but it is what it is I guess. It does have an external timing belt cover, which had some black dust settled on top of it that was definitely from the belt. More on Monday, Thanks.
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Sidom
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Dec 28, 2012, 10:40 PM
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Something doesn't sound right here. This has the coil in the dist & if you had the trouble with the wires that you did......How exactly did you test for spark and where??????
You don't need to r&r the v/c to remove the plugs, just an 3/8s extention....
You may want to back up and recheck some of this stuff......Get a spark tester and check for spark at the end of the plug wire.
I haven't seen to many of these jump time, usually the belt breaks or strips. If that is the case you just need to take off the dist cap and see if the rotor moves when it's cranked or take off the oil cap and if you can see the rocker arms, see if those move while the engine is cranked.....
12 hr day is tough, you can't get it towed closer to you?
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medicalpurposes
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Dec 29, 2012, 7:49 AM
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Originaly tested for spark by unplugging wire from dist cap and inserting screwdriver and holding wire near screwdriver to observe spark. Had extension w/me yesterday but my spark plug socket did not "grip" the plug well enough to pull them out of the "tunnel" in the valve cover.
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Hammer Time
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Dec 29, 2012, 7:55 AM
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The valve cover is only the top inch and the wires have to come off to even get the valve cover off. Grab the wire with something as close to the base as possible and twist and pull.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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Sidom
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Dec 29, 2012, 12:46 PM
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Well you need to check the stuff the other guys have posted about..But just a couple of quick things you can do. If you are trying to remove the plug but it keeps falling out of the socket, once it's all the way loose, just snap the wire back onto the plug & use the wire to pull out the plug or use a magnet.....
If the plugs look real bad, I would be tempted to throw a new set in and give a shot of starting fluid down the throttle body to see if that gets it to fire.....Also take a test light and check all the fuses....
Definity check the compression but this is just a couple of other things you can try seeing as how you are making long runs to do this......
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medicalpurposes
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Dec 31, 2012, 9:24 PM
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Well I did get a chance to get some compression readings from all 4 cylinders today. #1 95psi, #2 80psi, #3 135psi, and #4 110psi. I am guessing that is too much variance, but I was not tickled with doing this with valve cover on. I had to feed the test hose in each opening, down the 4-6 inches and blindly screw the connection from the other end of the hose and then plug in the gauge. Some holes I got 4 or 5 complete turns of the hose b4 it was tight, and others just 2 or 3 turns til tight, which makes me worry about how good a compression test I actually did. Does that make sense? Happy New Year to all by the way!!!
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Hammer Time
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Jan 1, 2013, 5:38 AM
Post #17 of 23
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Yes, you have some issues with those readings. Things are starting to point toward a timing belt problem and it may be time to remove the covers and check the timing marks.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Jan 1, 2013, 5:47 AM)
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Sidom
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Jan 1, 2013, 12:03 PM
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Yea like HT said, with readings like that, its time to pull the top cover & line up the marks. Takes a minimum of 100 lbs comp to fire a cyl.
You didn't like the plug set up on that???? What til you boy buys a Ford F150 5.4 and wants you to put some plugs in it for him,,,,,,You'll be wishing it was a Honda...........lol........  .
A good tip for putting plugs in those blind holes is, get a straight piece of vacuum line that fits tightly over the end of the top of the plug and start the plug that way. It's possible to crossthread a plug using a plug socket & extention but you will never crossthread a plug using vacuum line, you can't get enough force to crossthread it with the line but the vacuum line is strong enough to start the plug for a few threads before it starts "spinning" on the plug...
Man, is there any way you can get this towed home cheaply.....This is getting to the point where it would be a lot easier to do in your garage, or driveway.....
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nickwarner
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Jan 1, 2013, 12:37 PM
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Uhaul is pretty cheap to rent a tow dolly to you if you have a vehicle with a 2" receiver hitch and working light plugin. Less than the gas you're spending and it would free up all that drive time to work on it.
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medicalpurposes
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Jan 1, 2013, 6:05 PM
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The gas is no prob, I work near there. It is in my son's drive, but he has been gone...just wanted to get a sense of direction by the time he gets back. The plugs were easy once I read Sidom's post on using the tube like ends of the wires, just put them back in until they snapped onto the plugs and pulled them out...made me feel really dumb but glad it worked! It will be a few days, but will keep you guys updated...thanks!!!
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medicalpurposes
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Feb 2, 2013, 8:43 AM
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OK...weeks later, the son finally calls me asking for help. We got the covers off and all the marks line up correctly as per above diagram, The belt, water pump and tensioner look fantastic. Put the valve cover back on and turned it over...everything looked fine. We left it at that stage and decided to ask several for advice. What do you guys think?
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Sidom
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Feb 2, 2013, 11:30 AM
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Just a couple other suggestions.......After you put some oil in the cyl, install a set of new plugs & see if a couple shots of starting fluid down the throttle body will get the engine to fire.....
Also I don't know how you checked for spark but if you didn't use a spark tester you may want to pick up one at the parts store, wind the tester out to 40kv & check for spark. A weak coil will produce a spark out in the open but not in a cyl that is under compression........
If you can get a hold of a noid light......check to see if you have injector pulse
Also look at the fuel rail...If my memory isn't failing....I believe there is a ground attached to one end that if it gets loose, you will lose injector pulse...I think it looks like a braided ground strap
(This post was edited by Sidom on Feb 2, 2013, 11:32 AM)
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