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Engine cranks but won't turn over
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Old Pete
Novice
Jun 12, 2011, 2:22 PM
Post #1 of 8
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Engine cranks but won't turn over
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Hi,
My 2004 Toyota Rav -4 is cranking but won't turn over. 4 cylinder. 4 wheel drive. 80.780 miles. Automatic trans. Happened just this morning. Ran fine all day yesterday. No blown fuses or master fuses. Weird thing is when I hooked up my scan tool tool, rather than seeing error codes on the screen, the screen is displaying the word "ERROR". Can someone please tell me what that means, and what the problem is? Thank you.
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jun 12, 2011, 3:02 PM
Post #2 of 8
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Re: Engine cranks but won't turn over
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All "crank, no start" conditions are approached in the same way. Every engine requires certain functions to be able to run. Some of these functions rely on specific components to work and some components are part of more than one function so it is important to see the whole picture to be able to conclude anything about what may have failed. Also, these functions can ONLY be tested during the failure. Any other time and they will simply test good because the problem isn't present at the moment.
If you approach this in any other way, you are merely guessing and that only serves to replace unnecessary parts and wastes money.
Every engine requires spark, fuel and compression to run. That's what we have to look for.
These are the basics that need to be tested and will give us the info required to isolate a cause.
1) Test for spark at the plug end of the wire using a spark tester. If none found, check for power supply on the + terminal of the coil with the key on.
2) Test for injector pulse using a small bulb called a noid light. If none found, check for power supply at one side of the injector with the key on.
3) Use a fuel pressure gauge to test for correct fuel pressure, also noticing if the pressure holds when key is shut off.
4) If all of these things check good, then you would need to do a complete compression test.
Once you have determined which of these functions has dropped out,
you will know which system is having the problem.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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Old Pete
Novice
Jun 12, 2011, 7:31 PM
Post #3 of 8
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Re: Engine cranks but won't turn over
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Thank you "Hammer Time". We plan on checking checking for spark, fuel and injector pulse tomorrow. We're just looking to cover all the bases ahead of time. As I stated, I hooked up my scan tool and expected to see error codes, but instead of seeing error codes, I saw the word "ERROR" on the screen of my scan tool. Can you please tell what "ERROR" means. Also, do you feel the cranking, but not turning over could be due to a defective ignition switch? Thank you again sir.
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jun 13, 2011, 2:56 AM
Post #4 of 8
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Re: Engine cranks but won't turn over
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The error means the scan tool could not communicate for whatever reason. Your next step is to run the testing.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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Old Pete
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Jun 13, 2011, 7:09 AM
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Re: Engine cranks but won't turn over
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Thank you so much "Hammer Time"
I do know a little something about cars, and I know you need fuel, ignition spark and cylinder compression for an engine to start. I spent some time with the truck yesterday, and from what I could see, there is no place to connect a fuel pressure gauge. So then I thought I would find the fuel filter, disconnect the input fuel line to the filter, crank the engine, and see if fuel squirts out. The only problem with doing that is I couldn't find the fuel filter. I carefully looked in the engine compartment, under the truck and along the side rails of the truck I couldn't find anything that vaguely resembled a fuel filter. I also could not figure out to test for spark to the plugs. This RAV-4 has what I think is called a “Coil on Plug ignition system“. The plugs install threw the valve cover. Now rather than having conventional ignition cables that connect to the top of the plugs, there are wire connectors at the top of each plug. Each connector has three wires attached to it, and each connector is bolted to the top of the valve cover with a 10mm bolt. Can you please tell me how to check for spark and fuel to the plugs on this truck. If it helps my e-mail address is:
personal info deleted
Again thank you so much for your help and “God Bless You”.
(This post was edited by Hammer Time on Jun 13, 2011, 8:26 AM)
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jun 13, 2011, 8:35 AM
Post #6 of 8
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Re: Engine cranks but won't turn over
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That makes it tricky. There is no fuel filter. You would have to Tee into the line to read it.
As for spark, you would have to remove one of the coils and put a spark tester on the coil itself.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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Old Pete
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Jun 14, 2011, 5:20 AM
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Re: Engine cranks but won't turn over
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Thank you "Hammer Time". This is an excellent forum, and I appreciate and thank you all for your help. May God Bless You All.
I checked for spark by attaching a plug to the coil and then grounding the threads of the plug. If there is spark, then I couldn’t see it because the sun was too bright. I plan to do the same test again at night. After checking for spark, I removed the air filter box, and the rubber tube that connects the box to the throttle body. I sprayed carburetor cleaner into the throttle body, cranked the engine, and truck just about started. My question now is, does this mean that the engine is getting spark, and like I said I just couldn’t see it because the sun was too bright? Also does it mean that the injectors are “Not” firing? Am I correct in saying that when spraying starter fluid or carburetor cleaner into the throttle body that you are going “In Front” of the injectors? I didn’t want to cut into the fuel line to use an inline fuel pressure tester, so here’s what I did. The fuel line attaches to the fuel rail with two 10mm bolts. I removed the bolts, removed the line, cranked the engine, and saw a strong stream of fuel come shooting out. I know that this is a crude test, but do you feel it’s a good enough test to say that the fuel pump is good? What is your opinion of all this? Also do you feel the no-start could be due to a defective relay? Maybe more than one defective relay? If so where are the relay's and how do I check them? Thank you again so much.
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Hammer Time
Ultimate Carjunky
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Jun 14, 2011, 5:47 AM
Post #8 of 8
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Re: Engine cranks but won't turn over
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I understand your situation but your tests are a bit too crude to be able to determine much of anything. You need to use a spark tester and not a spark plug. You need to see it jump a gap of 3/8" or more, not just plug gap. Your fuel pump test didn't determine much either because you're looking for specific pressures. They make adapters for hooking up the gauge. Until you check injector pulse, you don't know much of anything yet. I know it sounds like you need a lot of tools but the fact is, you do.
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We offer help in answering questions, clarifying things or giving advice but we are not a substitute for an on-site inspection by a professional.
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